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News, Reviews & Commentary on Gay and Bisexual Men in Entertainment and the Media

Does Jimmy Kimmel Have a Problem with Gays?

Occasionally Kimmel’s show does take a more gay-inclusive approach to comedy. A hilarious “public service announcement” with George Takei made homophobes the butt of the joke for a change (but still relied on gay lechery for laughs).

Still, Kimmel is often behind the curve, at least when it comes to gay humor. It’s simply no longer acceptable that a major talk show host gets laughs from tired gay gags. Jay Leno, not exactly known for being cutting edge, has toned down the gay stereotypes after being famously derided in a 2006 open letter from Avenue Q playwright Jeff Whitty.

“When you think of gay people, it's funny,” Whitty wrote. “They wear leather. They like Judy Garland. They like disco music...You think gay people are great material…I think of a silent holocaust that is perpetuated by people like you, who seek to minimize us and make fun of us…I caught your show when you had a tired mockery of Brokeback Mountain, involving something about a horse done up in what you consider a ‘gay’ way. Man, that's dated.”

When it comes to gay jokes, the rest of the comedy world has changed or is changing. Will Kimmel?

RNRoc's picture

How about Conan?

I've read many complaints about Jimmy Kimmel on your site in recent months, but what about Conan O'Brien? If you take a closer look at Conan, he regularly plays around with being afraid of gays. He regularly "puts down" his band, teasing them that they are gay as if it's such a really bad thing. http://youtube.com/watch?v=7ubRVk2gt90 I bet if you guys did a close examination of Conan over the past two years, you would have tons of evidence of his homophobia. You can even compile it in a YouTube clip. But, no, that's not going to happen because he's Conan O'Brien. That's not homophobia. He's too cool for that! Jimmy Kimmel, on the other hand, is the ultimate symbol of male chauvenism (as co-creator of The Man Show, he just can't shake off that image). It's just too easy to scrutinize Kimmel.
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Bountiful's picture

I don't know what to make of Conan

Conan mocks himself enough that he doesn't come accross as mean spirited. But even when he mocks himself he still makes gay putdowns. I used to be a fan of Conan's but I get more jaded about him over time. I got frustrated waiting for him to realise that it's not a joke, and that he wasn't being funny.
Brent Hartinger's picture

Much (if not most) of what

Much (if not most) of what we write about is reader-driven. If we've written about Kimmel a lot lately, that's because we've heard a lot of buzz about. The idea that we wouldn't write about O'Brien because he's too "cool"? I don't know where that comes from. We try to monitor as much media as possible, but of course, we're only human, with limited resources. Feel FREE to send us tips! There's a button right up there on your left. Read my books! Explore "Brent's Brain" at http://www.brenthartinger.com
Fairy Gay Mother's picture

Mother is getting upset

My dears,

If this stuff bothers you ignore it; you are not going to change people; think how hard it is for you to change.

If this stuff makes you smile, good for you. Mother is smiling on you. You've earned your gay card www.fairygaymother.com

Nukely's picture

Same old, same old

Badgering someone to give you the answer you want to hear is rude, I always felt that Kimmel was a crappy interviewer. I agree about the Ben Afflic response, it starts out with the revenge photo's which is funny then relies on stereotypical jokes, even though some of the bits are silly. The only redeeming part is that he uses Sarah's song.

I don't like his show much. But is he that much worse than Leno, Letterman or Conan as far as gay-baiting goes? Conan is self deprecating, but he often falls hard on gay jokes when he needs a laugh. But I agree, if they all were competing for the worst gay joke, which I kinda wonder, I don't know who would be winning. I wish there was a way to turn it around.

 I stopped watching any of them much about the same time as Jeff Whitty's letter. Thank you, I haven't seen it before and it was relieving to read it. I've made a similar speech and was basically told to shut up -that was at a supposedly gay friendly party. I get the feeling that Whitty's sentiment is considered old fashioned in a world where the word "Gay" is slang for "stupid." We have to learn to lighten up, is what I'm told.

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Psionycx's picture

Kimmel does make fun of himself

I do feel the need to point out here that Kimmel does practice self-directed humor and this video was a case-in-point.

While a lot of people reacted negatively to the "stereotype" of "gay" clothing in the video it was actually part of the joke about the absurdity of the situation.  Sarah Silverman is quite attractive.  Maybe not as attractive as Matt Damon's actual wife.  But attractive enough that the idea of them having a fling isn't particularly absurd.

Jimmy, however, is so radically opposite Ben Affleck in looks that it was funny to think of them together.  And notice that it was Jimmy who was shirtless rather than Ben (whom we would much rather have seen without a shirt).  They even included a joke about Jimmy's "breasts" being bigger than Sarah's.  Jimmy's a schlub and he knows it.

So if part of Sarah's video was teasing that she was f***ing Matt Damon and he's so much hotter than Jimmy that "I don't pretend he's you", Jimmy's response joke was that yes, he's a schlub, but he's f***ing Ben Affleck!

The gay thing came into this mostly because of the legendary Damon/Affleck bromance, which is actually better known to the public than Damon's actual marriage.  If Sarah's video had been about doing Brad Pitt instead Jimmy would have had the pleasure of a reply video with Angelina Jolie.  Guess he should think more carefully about who he makes the butt of his jokes on his show...

Cameronj's picture

Light up... just slightly.

Yeah, these things are funny because they're borderline true. There is a sense of disappointment among parents, no matter how enlightened or accepting, when they find out that their child is gay. Which is why finding a playboy under one's son's bed might be a moment for quiet celebration.

 And what's more, a lot of what passes for gay culture is pretty freaking hilarious. I understand the need for activism, pride parades and sites like this one, but I don't understand the need for assless chaps in public during the daytime. At my first gay pride parade, I saw a man riding a bike around West Hollywood while wearing a mesh bodysuit that had a separate, yet equally transparent, sleeve for his cock. It was 3pm on a Sunday afternoon. For me, that's either sad or hilarious, or a little bit of both, and because we sometime present those stereotypes as representative of gay culture in some way (as opposed to exhibitionism), we can't really get mad if people make jokes.

And in the end, the "I'm f*cking Ben Affleck" piece, was only moderately funny because, unfortunately, Mr. Kimmel is only moderately amusing. That's why his show is rated just above Carson Daly's.

In the end, I guess, my point is that we do need to lighten up, just a touch.  Homophobia exists in very real, very dangerous ways within our society, and I think that, perhaps, if we could poke a bit more fun at ourselves, it might become clearer to the general public that we're more than cutoff wearing stereotypes.  And then maybe they'll let Luke and Noah kiss again -- a man can only hope.  

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Nukely's picture

Long live good taste

Assless chaps and fishnet body stockings?

A friend of mine used to call Gay Pride:

the Funeral March For the Death of Good Taste.

Evan's picture

No More

I agree with everything you said except that gay people should lighten up.  Anti-gay prejudice is NOT NEW.  This stuff has been happening for millenia.  It is way past time people challenge anti-gay prejudice. 

Unfortunately, I think gay people embrace stereotypes that some straight people have created for us.  I'm optimistic that eventually gay people will break away and finally be themselves.  For centuries throughout the world same-sex couples could only form unions if one was butch and the other feminine.  Today gay people are forming unions that are egalitarian which is what we truly are.

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db's picture

Darken up A LOT

Cameronj, I have to tell you that it really, really annoys me when I read the "lighten up" response to people pointing out homophobia, or even possible homophobia.  I believe that we, gay and lesbian people are already TOO LIGHT about it.  We're all so afraid of appearing uptight that we will never be taken seriously at all.  We don't appear easy going when we let slights roll off our backs--we appear wimpish.  We appear too afraid or too weak to fight back.  I say we need to get militant on these guys asses.  We're all too ready to go along with the on air bullies for fear they won't like us.
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Cameronj's picture

Eh...

I'm going to quote my favorite rapper here: "The strong move quiet, the weak start riots" (M. Bleek on a Jay-Z track).  We have to be selective about the battles we fight.  If we do, then when something truly is offensive and homophobic, our outrage has more impact.  

When we jump on every little thing, that's when we seem weak and oversensitive.  The ability to let some slights roll of one's back, but fight back when necessary is a mark of maturity and wisdom.  After all, aren't we supposed to not sweat the small stuff?  

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nordic balance's picture

But when is the right time

But when is the right time to fight a battle?  Why wait for a great, egregious transgression?  Usually, the greater attrocities in life could have been stopped had we listened to and acted upon earlier signs of each respective "apocalypse".  If we just shrug off these minor things, we will allow the greater offenses to occur.  Usually when one person takes a liberty, the next will take an even greater one when nothing is done about the first. 

I say that it's necessary to stop it now so that other, even bigger and more influencial jackoffs take our silence as permission to cause us greater harm.

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Junior's picture

Well Said

Of course, Kimmell doesn't care much for gay people.  Shocker?  I accepted the fact, more or less, within the last ten years that the majority of straight men are disgusted by gay men.  It doesn't carry the sting it once did when I was younger.  I don't even care enough to make the case that it has alot to do with their own insecurities, blah-blah, because I'm secure with myself and I realize that their is nothing I can do to change the way strangers feel about me.  I've come out to my family, friends, co-workers, etc., and in the process have made somewhat of an impact on them.  I've noticed that non-stereotypical gay men freak straight men out.  It really messes with their head.  Kimmell is vaguely familiar to me.  The few times I've tuned in to his show, he struck me as trying too hard.  His tired simple un-sophisticated gay "jokes" are coming from a place of fear, insecurity, and contempt.  We are much less threatening to straight men when they reinforce how different and freakish we are in their own minds.  And like others have said, we give them PLENTY of material to use against us.  That's not our problem though.  We should never shrink to make other's more comfortable around us.  Jeff Whitty's letter to Leno was brilliant.  Attack his craft and talent as a comedian.  That will shut them up quicker than whining and complaining.  Smart move.
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Evan's picture

100% Correct

Finally, a gay man that gets it.  I thought I was the only one.
Liz T's picture

not really bothered by it....

I don't watch the shows and I don't know if he is worse than the other hosts...and honestly...I don't care if he DOES have a problem with gay people or transgender people. reason being the following:

I feel like when people say "oh, you brought us down, you insulted us..." that only forces these people to apologize...when in fact, they could care less. they apologize because they are public figures and so many people know them.

I'd rather have these people lose repsect on their own and try their damndest to get it back. I would also like them to actually get out of their frat boy mindset and educate themselves about how we really are. no, i want them to get out there, know these people and then judge. if they still feel that gays are weird and whatever...then fine. but at least they went out, ya know?

Just like magazines, people tune in to this stuff. i have a feeling a majority of his viewers are probably in the same fratboy mindset as he is. that's fine. i don't watch his show...he is not hurting me. he is only making himself look like an ass. if he made fun of a murder victim of a hate crime, then yes....that's where my blood would boil. the thing about the ax was uncalled for. but if he is making fun of gays as a whole, I.E. "haha, that's so gay of you" then whatever. it's dumb yes....but why keep forcing these people to say sorry when they don't care?

let them fall on their own and try and get back up.

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Brent Hartinger's picture

I think you'd be shocked by

I think you'd be shocked by how often I hear from people I interview, "Oh. I never really thought of it that way." I had a friend who used to tell racist jokes until I said, "You know, I don't think that's all that funny." He said, "Wow, no one's ever said that before. You're right." I'd like to think AE isn't shrill or adversarial to the point of being tuned out. I think we have a POV, and by calling people's attention to slights or insensitivities that we perceive, I think it makes them think twice the next time a "gay" issue comes up. For many of these folks, they've honestly never thought about the repercussions of what they say. They just want the audience to laugh. But when they're reminded, "You know, that was a cheap shot," I think it can make difference. All that said, this IS comedy, and comedy is always subjective. Read my books! Explore "Brent's Brain" at http://www.brenthartinger.com
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Liz T's picture

ok..

"think we have a POV, and by calling people's attention to slights or insensitivities that we perceive, I think it makes them think twice the next time a "gay" issue comes up. For many of these folks, they've honestly never thought about the repercussions of what they say. They just want the audience to laugh. But when they're reminded, "You know, that was a cheap shot," I think it can make difference."

^ maybe it was mentioned, but has jimmy ever been called out before (not just the ax thing) for making a gay joke?

i honestly feel that people like Jimmy won't learn. they're like grown up children. you tell them no once...they'll stop...but once the flames have died down...they'll go right back to doing it again. just for a cheap laugh.

maybe the heads of ABC should step in and give him an ultimatum, because like i said...he has a right to not feel comfortable with gays...but he also needs a paycheck and so ABC should probably say "you keep your gay jokes at home, away from work..or you're out, because it is no longer acceptable" - - and i am sure he would eventually get sick of the sh-t hitting the fan everytime he made an offensive joke....but either way...i don't think he'll learn.

I do wonder though if when these hosts dish these jokes....how much is it from them or the writers?

 

 

db's picture

Hosts and Writers

"I do wonder though if when these hosts dish these jokes....how much is it from them or the writers?"

Liz, you must realize that it is the JIMMY KIMMEL SHOW and the writers can't force him to do material he doesn't want to do.  He's not just up there reading a moniter with no idea what he's saying. 

 

Psionycx's picture

Let's Be Fair Here

How often do gay comedians make jokes about straight people? Or rednecks? Or conservatives?

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db's picture

Psionycx, YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING

Are you really comparing the comments of all those obscure gay and lesbian comics to the comments--and really ill advised interviews by major network hosts? 
Psionycx's picture

db, Yes I am

Isn't there massive outrage right now over the hateful comments made by obscure Oklahoma state politician Sally Kern in remote forums mostly attended by people who already agreed with her anyway?

The gay community seems to consider any insult, no matter how when/where/how it is delivered as "hate speech".

Yet in all honesty, we are just as prone to make bigoted remarks and blanket generalizations without the slightest regard for who we offend.

Are you seriously saying that gay commedians making fun of other groups on networks like Logo or in stage shows is somehow more acceptable simply because they have less of an audience?  That sounds like a bit of a double-standard to me.  And it might surprise you to know that just as we often hear of offenses made against us, so do others hear about the things we say about them.

Kimmel's entire comedy schtick centers around him being a classic frat boy, schlump.  And just as the Man Show can be (and was) considered misogynistic, his current routines may be not always be pleasing to us?

Are you proposing a culture of censorship?  Because if you are I can assure you that the straights outnumber us, and if the idea of silencing anyone who disagrees with a certain opinion should gain hold and free speech be supressed, it is far more likely that we would be the ones getting gagged, and not anti-gay bigots.

 

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Ask Jerri's picture

Panties unnecessarily bunched

I completely agree that there is no good reason to treat someone's sexuality (or race, religion, disability, etc.) as a "bad thing" but I have to agree with Cameronj: lighten up. I read Whitty's letter to Leno and, while I think it is moving, beautifully written, and speaks to a fundamental misstep by mainstream Hollywood, I also think that in the right hands, everyone is an easy (and funny) target. Put simply, Silverman is fantastic at it; Kimmel is a hack. Period. Whitty's own play admits that "everyone's a little bit racist" as the characters talk about "stupid Pollocks," tell black jokes, and also admit that the "Jews have all the money." (And does anyone else remember the stereotypical gay puppet reading his "musicals of the 40s," for the love of Streisand? See, funny, right? Well, in better hands, maybe...) There will always be an audience for Kimmel (as well as Ann Coulter, Toby Keith, and that ilk.) Let's not waste space on a great site going after small (non-funny) fish like Kimmel, lifting rocks in search of a reason to call him a homophobe but instead, let's fight fires worth fighting, which was the (brilliant) meat of Whitty's letter. Let's fight hate, not a guy schlepping "frat boy" humor, vying for the 12 viewers at 3 a.m. who are probably watching an infomercial for pickle holders anyway.
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TheFabulousThomasJ's picture

Who Watches Jimmy Kimmel???

Round here, I can't name you one straight or gay buddy (male or female) who watches Jimmy Kimmel, save for the one or two who's seen him elsewhere and declare him a jerk.

 Sorry, gentlemen, I'm sitting this battle out.

 

Been there, done that, bought the soundtrack!

buzzbuzzard's picture

Saturday Night Live is also bad (in more ways than one)

SNL constantly makes tired gay jokes, especially in its fake commercials, special shorts (not the skits), and Ambiguously Gay Duo recurring cartoon. They pretend like it's gay friendly humor, and Tina Fey (a major writer) has expressed her support for gays in a few forums. Yet the show repeatedly relies on the same worn-out cliches and stereotypes. The Ambiguously Gay Duo is absolutely not funny, never has been, and I don't understand why Stephen Colbert (who does very pro-gay humor on his show and was hilarious as a gay teacher in Strangers wiht Candy) continues to do it. These aren't occasional events. I've stopped watching the show much because it's often just not funny period, but when I do there are at least three cringe-inducing gay-related skits or jokes each episode. Again, lazy and untalented writers falling back on humor that should have run its course decades ago, since it doesn't reflect even a small fraction of today's gays (especially younger ones). It's about as fresh as watching a standup talk about how black people and white people drive cars differently...
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Brent Hartinger's picture

Interestingly, we just MAY

Interestingly, we just MAY have an article on SNL in the works! ;-) Read my books! Explore "Brent's Brain" at http://www.brenthartinger.com
Ed Kennedy's picture

Seriously? I found it a light in a dark tunnel...

When I first saw Ambiguously Gay Duo, I honestly caught the over the top humor - I was in denial more than closeted, from a small town in WV. I don't have a clue what year it was, but shaky memory says it was 20 years ago. But it was gay humor, and I didn't sense any malice behind it. It was unique on television at the time. I've always tried to sense the intent behind humor that was offensive, and if the intent to harm wasn't there, I didn't take offense. I even went so far as to buy a SNL collection disc I had no interest in because it was hosted by The ambiguously gay duo.

 

Kimmel I can't take because he's just not funny. The man show wasn't funny. His show isn't funny. The Ben Affleck wasn't funny because of the stereotypes, but not because they're offensive, but because he didn't put the least bit of thought into his response to Sarah's incredibly inventive song. He more or less copied the song she wrote, but delivered it without commitment. He skipped the vivid visions they Sarah and Matt invoked passionately singing "on the bed, on the floor, byt the door" and instead took the easy, mindless way out by calling in celebrities and letting an intern stage the wardrobe. It wasn't that it was offensive, it was that, like all his jokes, there's just nothing new there, no thought, no hook, no insight. That's the sin of Jimmy.

Bobbyjoe's picture

Bill Maher, For Instance...

Brent: "I think you'd be shocked by how often I hear from people I interview, "Oh. I never really thought of it that way." I had a friend who used to tell racist jokes until I said, "You know, I don't think that's all that funny." He said, "Wow, no one's ever said that before. You're right.""

Bill Maher tells a similar story about being politely confronted by a gay man after one of his shows when Maher was still a young comedian. Maher acknowledged he wasn't thinking through what he was doing, relying on stereotypes for a cheap laugh, and he changed his act after that night. It's not like Maher no longer tells gay jokes, but if you watch his show, he's inarguably a vocal proponent of gay rights, and his gay material tends to be aimed at hypocrites like Larry Craig and Rudy Guiliani. So, definitely, even one person can make a difference if you ask some of these comedians to think about what they're doing. It's just that, too often, nobody bothers. I'm glad you and AfterElton do, Brent.

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dgd417's picture

Is Craig a homophobe?

I have become a HUGE Craig Ferguson fan over the last couple of years. He makes gay jokes all the time but I personally don't take anything that he says offensively simply because he's originally European (Scottish), and when he DOES say a gay joke, he always follows up with some gesture or comment which indicates that he's only kidding. The other late night hosts simply say a gay joke and that's it, nothing else. At least Craig makes it CLEAR that he's only kidding. I just find that his "approach" is much different than Dave/Jay/Conan/Kimmel. I also find that the "European attitude" towards gay people is FAR much better than the attitude of the U.S. Let's face it, Europe is far more liberal when it comes to matters regarding sex and/or sexuality. It's much more rampant over there than it is in the U.S. Europe's censorship laws are much "looser" than the ultra-conservative U.S. Sheesh, Luke and Noah on ATWT can't even share a kiss on a consistant basis. (Eye-roll) 

Craig's been in the U.S. since the 80's and his presence has only gotten stronger over the years, especially now since he recently (officially) became a U.S. citizen.

Any thoughts?

Does anyone care to tackle Carson Daly? I don't know too much about him. Peace :)

Regards,

dgd417

Randy Cragin's picture

What's really offensive.

The only thing (videos included) I found offensive was the Manshow skit. And this was because it involved the predisposition of a child's sexuality by an ignorant father. The audience cheer at the end made my stomach clench. This is worth getting upset about, the rest is not.

If finding a Penthouse under my mattress was a clear indication of my sexuality at that time, then the person finding it would be clearly wrong. Curious is not the word for it. Exploration of sex at a young age is just that, exploration. And although the rag displayed may of been of different content, you can be assured that the casual observer would see one thing, a busty female on the cover and would draw the wrong conclusion from there. In my day that magazine would have images of both men & women, mostly women, but men nevertheless. Straight geared porn was not afraid of male nudity back then, like it is now. And there were not only images, but stories. At that age I read constantly, I was obsessed with reading and I was vigorously reading everything I could get my hands on. After the novelty of any nudity wore off, the reading took over. And it was through that exploration that it finally dawned on me that I was constantly looking at the images with men in them and not the ones with just women. And it was reading an article about two men having sex that finally clued me in to what I was and wasn't.

It's quite possible that Jimmy could live to regret that skit.

Randy

RNRoc's picture

It was a JOKE!

I just wanted to point out another thing. You wrote: But then he told Bass, “I like you better now that you’re gay.” Does Kimmel really not know that gay people are “gay” even before they come out?" As somebody wrote on Towleroad regarding this article, it was a JOKE!: "Kimmel poked fun at the sudden change in public perception of Lance Bass following his announcement. (Lance Bass didn't change - the public's perception did.)" So basically you're bashing Kimmel for pointing out the stupidity of being homophobic! As I wrote above: Going after Kimmel is easy -- everybody hates him! -- with his "Man Show" past. But I truly doubt he hates gays. I truly challenge you to look into Conan (and perhaps, Ferguson, David Letterman and Jay Leno). You can simply type in "Letterman" and "Richard Simmons" on YouTube, and you'll find a wealth of "homophobia." (But, oh wait -- it's Letterman, it's ironic, unlike Kimmel.) Now that would be a story!
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RNRoc's picture

In defense of the Richard Cohen clip

One more thing: You have to keep in mind that Kimmel's biggest influences are David Letterman and Howard Stern.

Letterman, as you know, likes to be ironic. That's why he recently conducted interviews with Paris Hilton and The Hills star Lauren Conrad in a straightlaced manner.

Howard Stern, as well, will have guests like the "God Hates Fags" people and a KKK grand master without really challenging them.

What they both are trying to accomplish -- and what Jimmy Kimmel is trying to do with Richard Cohen -- is basically let the guest be himself/herself AND let them hang themselves.

You could, of course, look at the Kimmel interview of Cohen as him being totally in agreement with. But you could also see it as Kimmel *NOT INTERFERING* with his absurd ideas, and letting his ridiculous ideas shine through for what they are.

You can see this also in Kimmel's interview with Tay Zonday and the Tron Guy, both unusual people whom he treats as being normal, whether they are offensive or not.

Here's the Tron guy: http://youtube.com/watch?v=RsF2RUMmpqc

Here's Zonday: http://youtube.com/watch?v=NattlyH0IeM

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Brent Hartinger's picture

For the record, I didn't

For the record, I didn't "bash" Kimmel for the Bass comment--I write specifically "The line was probably meaningless banter." But (assuming you're gay) if someone said to you after coming out, "Oh, you decided become gay, huh?" I suspect you might think that speaks to the speaker's state of mind on gay people. I would. Read my books! Explore "Brent's Brain" at http://www.brenthartinger.com
Hephaestion's picture

Kimmel is a homophobe

Kimmel, like most straight boys, is a homophobe and he refuses to acknowledge it, because he doesn't HAVE to analyze his behavior or comments and no one challenges him on them. People have to be challenged in order to learn, and we need to challenge these assholes more often than we currently do. Otherwise they will keep spouting the same old antigay shit over and over and over, thinking it's acceptable so long as their girlfriend talked them into voting for a Democrat once a few years ago. Bill Maher came to my GAY neighborhood in DC for a book talk and opened with an ANTI-gay joke. Even Garrison Keillor has made anti-gay comments. And these are our "allies." We have a long ways to go.
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dsc's picture

The interview with Sanjayah was downright mean

I have no idea if he is or isn't gay but that kid must be called gay like 24/7 at his school. To put him on the spot like that was just plain mean. He is a kid for Christ's sake. Yes, a famous one given his turn on Idol but a kid nonetheless. This was worse than the Leno interview of Ryan Philippe which was roundly criticised. There, at least, Philippe had merely played gay on TV not been assumed to be so by millions.
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