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AE: Let's dish about casting Making Love, shall we?
BS: They started out at the beginning wanting major stars. Every movie wants that at
the beginning. Some of them gave us consideration. Michael Douglas thought about it for several weeks, then backed out. Tom Berenger. Richard Gere. Harrison Ford turned it
down flat.

We started to get rumblings that [a right-winger] was about to buy the studio. And everybody got real nervous that if we weren't in production soon, they might pull the plug.

So we decided the star was the subject matter. We decided to go with the best actors we could find. Michael [Ontkean] and Harry [Hamlin]. They were both up-and-comers.

For Claire, the producer said let's go after a television name for the actress, an actress that everyone is familiar with and comfortable with. She's kind of like the anchor, the character that straight audiences will relate to and guide them through this kind of journey. Her face is the first image on the screen and the last image on the screen.
Kate [Jackson] was desperate to do it. Her manager was calling every day. So we went with her.

AE: After all these years, how do the actors feel about the impact that the movie has had on their careers?
BS: I know that Harry [Hamlin] is very proud of it. And let's face it, he got L.A. Law right after that and became a huge TV star. Kate also went on to be a huge series star in The Scarecrow and Mrs. King.

AE: Is Michael Ontkean bitter?
BS: Oh, not at all! He sent me the most beautiful letter, which I read at the 20th anniversary screening, saying how proud he is of the film, what a wonderful experience it was.

AE: How does Brokeback make you feel? Proud? A little jealous? What's your reaction as the screenwriter who did the first major movie like this?
BS: A lot of different feelings. Overriding everything is the fact that I think it's a terrific movie. I just nominated it for the Academy Award.

AE: Incidentally, I think it's so cool that you're a member of the Academy!
BS: Well, my perfect Academy Award night would be Brokeback, Felicity Huffman, and Phillip Seymour Hoffman. The gay cowboys, Truman Capote, and the transsexual.

If Brokeback doesn't win, not only would I be depressed, I think there'd be a real reason for it. Because there's not a better film this year. Forget what it's dealing with.

AE: It's funny, because I'm 41, but I still want the approval, the validation that a Best Picture Brokeback win would give me. Both Brokeback and Making Love, I think they capture the sense of what it means to be gay. They get their finger on the issue, the sense of alienation, the sense of self-discovery, and the price that must be paid to be true to yourself, which I think is almost like a Greek epic.
BS: You're right. That's the strongest comparison you can make between the two movies. They're about the price you pay to be true to yourself. One emerges happy, and one doesn't. But they both pay a price.

As for the two films, I will say I don't like it when Brokeback and Making Love are compared, and I've read that a lot. I don't think that's fair, I don't think you can compare the films. First, Making Love is not a love story between two guys, it's a coming out story, not a love story.

AE: Oh, yeah, they're very different movies!
BS: It's the guy's discovery of his true nature. The other guy's the catalyst, but the core of the film is the relationship between the married couple, and how he has to come to terms with who he is.

Liz Smith summed it up a couple of weeks ago in a column in the New York Daily News, as fine a movie as Brokeback Mountain is, Making Love is a more positive and encouraging movie. But it didn't make any money, and she suggested that maybe that was the reason why.

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