
Mark Ballas
This coming Monday morning, ABC's Dancing with the Stars is expected to announce the line-up for the show's new season (debuting September 21st). Gay fans are hopeful the show will finally have its first out gay competitor in former 'NSYNC member Lance Bass. For months now, speculation has run rampant that he would be joining the show and that in turn has fueled further speculation that Lance might actually be paired up with one of the show's professional male dancers.
Back in January we asked DWT executive producer Conrad Green about having a same-sex dance pairing. Green said the thought the idea "interesting," and that he was "open to it." And ABC Entertainment President Stephen McPherson is also on board with idea saying, "Yeah. I think there's no reason not to."
At the Television Critics Association Summer Tour in Los Angeles last month, I had the chance to chat with some of the professional dancers from ABC's Dancing with the Stars. I took the opportunity to ask Mark Ballas and Alec Mazo their thoughts about the possibility of Lance Bass joining the show as a contestant — and of being matched up with a male partner.
Mark Ballas
AE: There is talk Lance Bass might be one of the contestants this year. There is also speculation he might be matched up with a guy.
MB: I know. I was the pick. In the rumor, I was the person they said they should match him with.
AE: And how do you feel about having him on the show?
MB: I think it would be great having him on the show. But no one has been confirmed.
AE: I'm not trying to find that out. I'm just curious how you might feel about being matched up with him.
MB: It's kind of against the [dancing] rules to do that.
AE: But you're a television show.
MB: I know, but it has rules. We're not allowed to lift. We're not allowed to lift at all. We're not allowed to do a lot of things. One of the main rules in the dancing rules is that it has to be a man and a woman. But if they wanted to break the rules for it and put two men together ... that would be cool! It would be breaking the rules and if it happened to me, I'd probably ... dance everything in unison. I wouldn't dance it ... like if it happened to be the girls steps, I'd have him do man steps and I'd do man steps at the same time. So that's how I'd do it. I think it would be interesting. But I'm not sure if they will do it.
AE: Do you think America is ready for that?
MB: I don't know. I don't want to say.
AE: I know a lot of folks last year thought Kristi Yamaguchi had a big advantage given her background. Given Lance's background, the same thing will be true?
MB: Not at all. Ballroom dancing is a different animal. Doesn't matter if you've had a dance background. As an ice skater, you don't have a dance background. When you're on skates, you're flat-footed and on bent knees and they skate through the music. Kristi didn't have that experience. Same for Lance and Joey Fatone and Mel B. The only person that would have an advantage is a ballroom dancer. I've seen some of the most amazing ballet dancers, jass dancers, hip hop dancers, and they can't do ballrooom dancing. It's a completely different animal. So if Lance comes on, I think it will be great.
My chat with Alec Mazo, after the break!
Alec Mazo
Alec Mazo
AE: What would you think of having Lance matched up with yourself or one of the other guys from the show?
AM: I think ... I don't think it's gonna happen because Middle America ... and because I don't know how the choreography would be able to [work] and I'm thinking how would you do that?
AE: Well, there is gay ballroom dancing.
AM: You know what? Actually, I think a good partner for him would be Louis [Van Amstel]. Louis has done a little bit in Denmark. I think he's choreographed some. So he would know. I would not know how to do it simply because I've never done it. So experience-wise it would be a little different for me. Somebody who is more proficient like Louis would probably be in a better position than me. But I think Lance would probably do a great job. I don't know if he is on the show or not, but if he does get on the show, he'll be a phemonmenal dancer. I don't know how a show like that would be able to work it out right now. I don't know. I have to be able to wrap my mind around that. ... I don't know how that would work physically. Considering you have lifts and everything.
AE: You look strong. You could lift Lance.
AM: Have you seen Lance? Lance is my height and bigger than me.
AE: Then he could lift you.
AM: That's true. It's a very unique question. Thanks for asking.
you can sense their skin crawling...
"One of the main rules in the dancing rules is that it has to be a man and a woman."
That's hilarious! So is there a D.O.D.A.? (Defense Of Dancing Act?)
rules
Ballas doesn't clarify if he is speaking to specific Dancing with the Stars rules or not, but the National Dance Council of America (NDCA) is the governing body for competitive ballroom dance, and they do specify that "a couple is defined as a male and a female" (Section II.A.4.a.).
And I really don't sense that their skin is crawling. Same-sex pairing on the dance floor is just not a part of the world they work in.
Let me just say that I didn't get any kind of
uncomfortable vibe from either of the guys that they thought the idea of dancing with a man to be icky. I just think they hadn't thought about the question before and weren't really prepared for it. But both tried to be thoughtful and thought through the implications.
And I agree that just because Lance is gay doesn't mean he has to be paired up with a man, but the show has been on for years and it would be nice to be a same-sex pairing whether Lance or not.
Alec: I don't know how that
Alec: I don't know how that would work physically. Considering you have lifts and everything.
Mark: We're not allowed to lift. We're not allowed to lift at all.
Is it just me or is there a lot of BS from these guys to avoid being paired with Lance?
Not quite
Ballas was talking about a framework of rules the show has, which includes a complete injucntion against lifts, with notable, but rare excpetions.
Mazo was talking about those rare exception in which a pair is not competitive if they don't have fairly impressive lifts.
They were addressing different aspects of the difficulties
I've always been a bit
I've always been a bit confused why one would pair Lance with a guy just because he is gay. Just because he is gay. they'll make him do girlsteps? Or just because he is gay you can't expect him to lead a woman during a dance?
Most dances are laid out for male/female routines, so wouldn't a couple that has to do same sex dancing have a disadantage because they have to learn new things or can't do certain lifts or can't use the frilly costumes the girls wear for effect?
I would be all for them to do a same sex round where everybody gets paired with a same sex partner, so all have the same advantage/disadvantage.
To me dancing is just dancing. Wouldn't it be as much as a "message" to show that a gay male can be just as good a male lead dancer and a female/male coupling as any straight guy? And if male/male or female/female dancing is an interesting category itself, why not have everybody have to do it rather than just the gay guy?
Through reading AE I have kinda got what the intention of supporting this is, I'm guessing that credit be given to Lance's sexuality, but my first instinct was to find it a bit strange that he should be given a male dance partner just because he's gay.
At a certain point, leave well enough alone
One thing they would have to do in order to make this fair is either limit the pair as to who can lead and who can follow, at least in each week's dance, if not for the entire competition, or allow all couples to have lead changes.
If they did the former, it would put one partner or the other in the "woman's" role, and that might have its own PR disadvantages.
If they did the latter, I suspect some of the professionals would be upset, as that completely changes the nature of the competition.
I'm with LolaRuns on this. An out gay contestant is the win here. Same sex pairings really doesn't add anything to it... well, other than some really hot dance routines.
Boy, Alec Mazo really got nervous there
Boy, Alec Mazo really got nervous there, or at least startled by the question.
And what a strange comment about Denmark, because all those scandinavians are really up with same sex ballroom dancing. Or am I missing something?
At least Ballas was willing to work it out in his head. Which wasnt a bad idea to resolve the issue of "roles". I find it interesting that people have been for years trying to break the idea of gender roles and yet, there are aspects of life that apparently are untouchable. And what do you know? Ballroom dancing is one of them. Well, at least some are starting to think and talk about it.
I dont think he should be paired why a guy just because he is gay, an out contestant would be a great step, but if they are willing it could be done.
I agree with somebody who
I agree with somebody who earlier mentioned that So You Think You Can Dance will be a much better platform for same-sex pairing,since it is really hard for two boys to do ballroom.
Actually, it's not really hard for "two boys to do ballroom"--
Pairing up
I agree, I've always thought it odd that they would pair Lance with a guy just because he's gay. Especially because this isn't just a dance "show" but a competition based on a very standardized set of rules, and has a lot of tradition behind it. Lance should be able to compete without "special" circumstances.
I agree with the idea that if they do a same sex pairing than all people should do it. And gay ball-room dancing exists and they have their own rules and guidelines, so it's not like the dancers would have to make it up from scratch.
all that being said, a guy-guy tango is pretty damn sexy thing
www.thebittersuite.blogspot.com
First, I agree that just
First, I agree that just because Lance is gay doesn't mean that he HAS TO to be paired with a guy.
That being said -- I think Mark Ballas came up with a great approach. He said, "I'd probably ... dance everything in unison. I wouldn't dance it ... like if it happened to be the girls steps, I'd have him do man steps and I'd do man steps at the same time. So that's how I'd do it. I think it would be interesting."
That would play to both partners' strengths and make for a really dynamic routine. I'd love to see that!
BTW - So You Think You Can Dance already paired two guys this season but only for one dance and only because the eliminations left them one woman short for the pairings. Whether or not either or both of them is gay is something we'll probably never know considering how closeted the dance world seems to be. The routine they did was great but, of course, didn't involve any "intimate" moves.
Different types of dancing
When I think about this though I think about acrobats, which a generally performing a kind of "dance". Cirque de Soleil and many other shows have used male-male pairs and groups for intricate performances where there was no single "lead" and the performers needed to be equally strong as they assuming alternating "lead" positions.
At issue, I suppose, are the conventions of ballroom dancing which assume that during a performance one persons leads and this does not change throughout the performance.
To me a male-male acrobatic performance where the roles are equal are as beautiful as a ballroom dancing performance where one person leads and the other is led. But it would require some mindset changes in the realm of dancing where there has always been a strong sense of who does what.
Remember, "Dancing" already did this with Steve G. and Jonathan
Future epitaph: "It seemed like a good idea at the time."
What I really appreciated about last year's routine was the obvious effort and good naturedness that Jonathan put into it, as well as Steve Guttenberg (who was obviously over his head dancing with ANYONE). However, there was still a bit of a camp element to it--a "Oh look, we didn't have a female partner, so we did this, isn't it funny?" undertone. If Lance did it, it'd be tricky because he'd have to do things completely (ahem) straight--and while America might actually really enjoy watching two men do a scorching, powerful dance like the Pasa Doble, or a fast fun one like the Jive, they might squirm seeing them perform something with a romantic element like a waltz, or a blatantly sexual one like the rhumba or samba. This then brings in the possibility of pairing him with a female partner for most of the show, and then letting him do one "exhibition" dance with a male partner--but that brings in an element of "Oh, look at the freak show." (And none of the other couples would get this option, so why should he?)
Serious conundrum going on here.
RE: Last Season's Male/Male Pairing
there was still a bit of a camp element to it--a "Oh look, we didn't have a female partner, so we did this, isn't it funny?" undertone
I appreciated that from both of them, and I'd even go one extra step and substitute the word 'funny' for the term 'good-natured'.
They both made it seem like they were willing to to go outside the box (even if it made themselves or others uncomfortable) and that the world would not come crashing down around us all for doing so.
I find it incredibly masculine/sexy when straight men move into uncomfortable areas like that. Even if they're just trying to prove to themselves that they can 'handle it'. In a back-handed kind of way, it's pretty progressive.
-Sibelius
"It's curtains for you, Dr. Horrible. Lacy, wafting curtains..."
Two men dancing is teh sexx
Is it really so hard to wrap one's head around? Why are we thinking of it in terms of boy part and girl part? Why not, partner 1 and partner 2? Then you just pick a part and stick with it and dance the hell out of it. Psionycx makes a good point about mindset changes, but really, is it that hard?
I would love for Lance to go on, and I would love for him to be paired with a guy, because really... who else can they do that with? It's an idea whose time has come, and I think it'd be a shame if it was passed up for too much longer. I try to be a cynic, but truly, watching to men dance gets my heart all a-flutter. I'm pulling for this possibility!
Because it gets difficult to
Because it gets difficult to judge because you're comparing apples-and-oranges if you have one M-M dance pair and the rest are M-F. Also the outfits play a role in some dances... do you expect Lance to do drag?
I don't know how easy it would be fore the professional male dancers to take on the female parts either if they even tried to keep the same routines rather than have two males dance the male parts. Frankly, all the gay blog chatter clamoring for pairing off Lance with a guy just because he's gay is offensive to me.
He happens to be gay, that's it. He should be allowed to compete on an even playing field like all the others and, in this competition, that means mixed-gender partners.