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"Torchwood: Children of Earth: Day Three" minicap
Last night I commented on how Day Two of Children of Earth was lacking a bit of pizzazz, and apparently viewers agreed with the audience share for the program dropping by 300,000 viewers. But if Day Three is anything to go by, audience members will be back and eagerly anticipating the final two episodes in the miniseries. Warning - Spoilers ahead! So some of you may already know the end of Day Two saw Ianto rescue Jack from the government (who had held him captive), and the aliens (or the 456 as they are better known) declared that they "would be coming" tomorrow. Now that today is tomorrow, both the government and Torchwood eagerly await their arrival as they prepare their plan of attack. The Torchwood gang gather underground, but without their flashy attire or their gizmos at hand, they decide to act like "criminals" to get by. This leads to a rather exciting scene, which sees the rugged Jack dashing across a street and hijacking a sports car. Oh, and Jack’s pulsating bum muscles, which are bolstered by his tight fitting sweatpants, also help add a bit of zing to this thrilling moment.
Back to the plot now, if that’s what you really want! Rhys goes in a fit of frenzy when he finds out that he was the last to hear about Gwen being pregnant (he is the father after all), Jack gets his uniform back, thanks to the lovely Ianto, and Lois Habiba is recruited by Gwen to help her infiltrate the government, with none other than a pair of super-slick contact lenses (don’t ask!) Personal tensions rise when Jack’s daughter is captured by Johnson, and is subsequently used as bait by the government to get Jack to cooperate. There are also a few intimate moments between Ianto and Jack, which are dotted subtly across the episode. Basically, when push comes to shove, the couple sit down and discuss their future together. Gradually, it is revealed that Ianto is conflicted with the realization that he will eventually die and since Jaci is immortal, he will be there to watch him go through it, and then carry on living.
But besides this instance, the couple rarely ever express any form of affection towards one another. I was left wondering whether this was a genuine romance at all, or just another intricacy to the crafty plotline. Surely if the audience is to believe that Ianto and Jack’s relationship is genuine, they need to see some PDA’s (even if they are only manifested in macho/brethren like man-hugs). Then there are the aliens that you have all been waiting for. Well the answer is that nothing really happens here. It’s more of an exercise in suspense. There is no big reveal, just a voice that speaks behind a glass shell in Mr. Frobisher’s offices, and occasionally spews goo at him. Eventually Frobisher and the alien leader try to flesh out a deal … but when the 456 request a special gift (i.e. 10% of the world’s children), Frobisher and his officials are left in a state of utter shock.
Besides all of this dramatic tension, there is that crazy old man who hears alien voices (you know the one who we thought meant nothing to the plot, and I, as of yet, have never mentioned him?). Well, his name is Clement McDonald, and in a shocking twist of events, it turns out that he was in fact sacrificed to the aliens as a child back in 1965 (re: the opening scene of Day One). And who do we think sacrificed him to the aliens? The government? Some weedy 456 allies? Wrong! It was none other than ... Believe it or not ...
Our very own super stud hero Jack Harkness! What is Jack hiding, and why did he do it? All will be revealed tomorrow in Day Four of the series! Submitted by on Thu, 2009-07-09 08:38. |
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it's a long time since I
it's a long time since I was glued to tv/youtube like this. I usually work while watching tv but that's impossible right now - so I decided to eat while watching - and keep forgetting that as well :D
it's a great format and I can't wait till tomorrow.
BUT - strange thing though: it's not the Torchwood-gang that keeps me the most entertained.
They were strangely passive this episode. Might work better, when one watches all episodes in a row.
Oh, and by the way: What have they done to Rhys? So he's the comic relief now - and a boring one. And they are unnecessarily back with Gwen's idiotic behaviour towards him. Boo! Don't see any sense in that.
Ianto/Jack - okay, nothing unexpected there.
Who has me far more interested is that Frobisher-guy (and Peter Capaldi's brilliant brilliant performance). Has he some superior motives? Is he a baddie hiding behind the civil servant? Is he a civil servant eagerly heading towards his one hour of glory? Is he dreading it and acting out of duty? Or both? Does he know at all, what he's doing? etc. And one still sort of likes him - he's utterly human. Great acting there.
To me the revelation about Jack isn't half as interesting, they will find an explanation. But maybe I'm more intrigued with the Frobisher-storyline because there might actually be important figures like that out there in real life. Unkillable rogue time-agents? Not so much :D
The World's Always Ending
First of all, I watched this episode with my family last night, and my Doctor Who fan brother (who isn't into Torchwood) loved it. He so impressed that the aliens were actually creepy and "not sexbots". I'm with him there. This show is so good. What is this deliciously cool show and what have they done with the cheesy, plot-hole ridden, confusing show we've known Torchwood to be?
Good job RTD and Euros Lyn! FTW!
Surely if the audience is to believe that Ianto and Jack’s relationship is genuine, they need to see some PDA’s (even if they are only manifested in macho/brethren like man-hugs).
Yeah, the thing that seemed odd to me was that even while sitting on the couch they sat on opposite ends. Last time I checked, that was nonverbal "not together". Are they trying to show how scared Ianto is of being perceived as gay? Because you'd think that issue would have come up a long time ago. Him and Jack have been going out on dates since the beginning of season two as far as we know, right? So why is he just now freaking out about it?
The little "oi!" when Clement called him queer was a bit endearing to me, but I've heard it stirred up some stuff, so I'd like to hear what others have to say about it.
The thievery binge was sweet. My brother and I were chuckling and he is convinced that Torchwood just made stealing cool. I can see why restaurant-goers would believe classy, fashionable Ianto as a waiter, but filthy t-shirt and sweat pants Jack? Not so much. It was a good look for him though. But Ianto being a good boyfriend was worth him changing back into the boring old outfit as seen in the first two seasons. Jack, you don't deserve him. And you also possibly need to calm him down about the whole "dating a guy" thing, because I think the implications of their "couple" talk are finally becoming more clear to the viewer.
Gareth David-Lloyd. Oh my word. That an can ACT. I loved his awkward/excited little smirk he got after he and Jack decided to "make the most" of their time. Immediately. For twenty - no! - thirty minutes. And then the gutted look at the end when they found out about Jack's involvement with the 4-5-6. MY WORD. Gareth, you're so talented and beautiful! Let's get married!
And I agree with Lily of the valley, Mr. Frobisher is a great character, and the actor who plays him has nailed the role. He's so sympathetically villainous, its wonderful.
Annnnd... I practically wrote a book. Go me. :P
"To make a bad day worse, spend it wishing for the impossible." - Calvin of Calvin and Hobbes
GDL
I agree, Gareth can act really well and he's very hot in that slightly geeky, awkward kinda way. I wish i asked my tutor (who taught him in college) more about him. DARN!
As far as the 'Queer' thing i think (like another post says) that it shows that the older generation might still act like its 1965 and not realise those terms can be offensive, also i think we can just laugh cos the man who said it has been locked in an insane asylum for god nows how long, was almost taken by aliens and can smell them, while having alien meltdowns in the middle of pub, LOL.
My tonuge would catch your tongue...were the world mine :-)
Weakest so far
To me, this may have been the weakest episode of the series, but then the middle often is - you have to have the core of the story somewhere in the action.
I don't really understand how the Americans were portrayed - we sent a 4-star general instead of an ambassador? I can probably buy that our egos were bruised that this didn't happen in DC, we're a pretty arrogant bunch. And why would we, or the British PM care about whether it was an elected official or a civil servant? I feel I'm missing something.
I also found the spewing of the aliens to be a little gross, but guess I get there needs to be something visual, but they don't want a full reveal.
My memory keeps being tickled that this plot of "give us a % of the children" sounds familiar from the Who-verse, wasn't there something about a percentage of the population in the multi-part episode where the Master had control of the air carrier and the world, and brought the flying aliens (maybe our future selves?) to take over? It just feels somewhat derivative of something else to me.
Finally, while I thought this next bit was laugh-out-loud funny, but parts of Twitter seemed to not like, what did everyone think about crazy old smell guy shouting "Queer!" at Ianto? I found it storyline appropriate and darn funny, but a lot of friends on Twitter were ticked. Curious what people here thought.
All this said, can't wait for tonight!
Like I said,
I wasn't bothered. What were people on twitter saying? Because all I've been hearing is that is was the topic of some debate, and I'm not sure why.
"To make a bad day worse, spend it wishing for the impossible." - Calvin of Calvin and Hobbes
It's similar
It's not all that dissimilar to the conversations some have had on here (though less civilized than here) concerning Ianto's "issues" with either being seen as gay, or being seen as part of a couple.
A lot of people seem to be taking Ianto's "Oi!" (and that's an odd expression as an American, I can't even pronouce properly, much less get that level of indignation into it) as internal homophobia. And Clem's as blatant homophobia. I don't see it that way, naturally.
I think it's fun watching Ianto figure himself out. Others seem less forgiving of the journey.
Ianto and The "Queer!" Thing.
I thought Ianto's response made sense.
Clem was being inappropriate because he's stuck in 1965. In some ways he never got to grow up because his mind never recovered so he's still "10" years old.
Ianto's didn't say "I'm not gay or queer" he said "Oi, it's not 1965 anymore" as if to say, calling someone names because they are gay is not how we do it now a days.
I think folks are being extremely overly sensitive to evey move and inflection Jack and Ianto make.
They have been sexually active since the "They Keep Killing Suzie" episode but they've only been "discussing" the nature of their relationship since "Kiss Kiss Bang Bang".
Given what they have both been through (Ianto and Lisa and Jack and his many lost loves) are people really surprised that they don't respond to each other the way Rhys and Gwen do?
Also, Rhys is mostly ignorant to most of what Gwen has been through and DONE so there is a lot less baggage between them (Gwen doesn't seem to have any guilt about her own actions so there you go...)
Jack and Ianto have never been physically demonstrative unless they are in private or there was an extreme situation. They banter and flirt but it's usually subtle or under their breath (for the most part)
I also think Ianto has had to watch Jack die so many times now and it might be taking its toll (even though he knows he'll come back)
I'm not sure they knew what to say to each other when they were sitting on the couch but then they got back to being more comfortable when they were side-by-side flirting because they were each in their own element.
I think the way these characters relate to each other makes sense because they aren't just your average two men falling in love. They are like tragic superheroes who are broken and full of loss and regret and sadness and guilt. They LITERALLY have the weight of the world on their shoulders like every other week.
Viewers need to cut them some slack on the PDA "please define the nature of your relationship" things and just have some faith. When Janto are on screen together, I always feel the love even if they aren't being physical.
"That's our job today: to control the extent to which people can publicly manifest antigay sentiment." (Bayard Rustin) ** "Heterosexuality is not normal, it's just common" (Dorothy Parker)
Viewers need to cut them
Viewers need to cut them some slack on the PDA "please define the nature of your relationship" things and just have some faith. When Janto are on screen together, I always feel the love even if they aren't being physical.
Me too. I've always thought that what really made Jack/Ianto's relationship work was that John and Gareth have great chemistery that really comes across on-screen. I'm so glad that the writers decided to make their relationship canon instead of sub-text.
Jack and Ianto
Yeah, you're right, that makes sense now. And, someone else mentioned, Gwen and Rhys aren't exactly getting a lot of romance time either.
And yes, some of te nonverbl stuff between them is suer cute. The way they look at each other when they're talking while on the computers... so sweet.
"To make a bad day worse, spend it wishing for the impossible." - Calvin of Calvin and Hobbes
Politics and dopes
If you knew some of the charmless, ignorant and even outright offensive dopes the US has sent over to be ambassador in the UK over the years, it makes perfect sense that a general would be portrayed as the best the US had to offer.
One of the Bush ambasadors over here was the perfect servant to his master insofar as he actively antagonised the people of London and really abused diplomatic priviledge. If the writers lived in London, I can understand why they'd prefer to write about the military rather than the diplomats. We haven't had a good American ambassador for about a decade. Sorry, rant over.
On the civil servant being used rather than a politician, it's probably a thing of British politics. Basically, the prime minister doesn't want to get too close to the aliens in case it all goes horribly wrong (and let's face it, in the Whoverse it always goes horribly wrong for politicians). He doesn't want himself or his political party to be associated with a possible disaster.
In the UK, the politicians always blame the Civil Service for screw-ups. In return, top civil servants get knighhoods and big pensions when they retire from being a politician's whipping boy.
The 'queer' thing didn't bother me. Paul Copely (the actor playing the crazy old man) is skilled enough to play it for comedy rather than offence and perfectly set up Ianto's response. I thought it was laugh-out loud funny, too.
10%, and Americans
...wasn't there something about a percentage of the population in the multi-part episode where the Master had control of the air carrier and the world, and brought the flying aliens (maybe our future selves?) to take over?
Yes, there was - and I was reminded of that too. At the end of The Sound of Drums, the Master told the Toclafane (i.e. our future selves) to remove one tenth of the population.
I can probably buy that our egos were bruised that this didn't happen in DC, we're a pretty arrogant bunch.
This also reminded me of The Sound of Drums, when the American president is notably annoyed that the contact with the Toclafane is happening in Britain.
A drop of 300,000 viewers
A drop of 300,000 viewers is nothing really...the majority of programmes suffer the rules of decreasing ratings on the second episode because the first episode determines whether people like it or not, and as with everything not everyone is going to like it. So a drop of only 300,000 is pretty good actually.
About the Jack/Ianto intimacy...they're in the middle of a crisis, they couldn't even schedule in some alone time because of Rhys and the beans, LOL. It's nothing surprising. Not to mention that Rhys and Gwen weren't showing much intimacy either. If they were then I would be complaining because obviously that would have screamed of double standards.
Even though I hate the word queer in any context, the OI! and the 'this isn't 1965 you know' from Ianto, more than made up for it lol. It's showing a truth that the older generation sometimes don't realise how offensive that term is and it also made the stance that we're in the 21st century now, those words shouldn't be used under any circumstances. This made the scene quite funny as well. Other funny moments included us finding out that the Torchwood contact lenses had been used for fun by both couples LOL. And also when Gwen is typing, the whole thing about her not liking smilies and then she ends up using them and then the 'I can't see his moth' typo which Rhys berates her for. Funny stuff. The best episode so far! :D
Am I the only one who
I didn't get the innuendo
Dr. Hotpants
Am I the only one still reeling from the death of Rupesh in the first ep? Isn't it some brand of evil to parade such eye candy in front of us for an hour with vague promises of making him Torchwood's new doc and then callously killing him off?
I keep hoping that energy from Jack rebuilding himself leaked into the next room and maybe resurrected Rupesh and he'll show up to save the day in the end.
Really? Am I the only one holding out hope?
haha, Rupseh
I was sad that the hottie doctor died too but so much has happened since then I almost forgot about it. I doubt they'll bring him back, but it would make for an interesting lot twist. I'm sure viewers would not be at ll disappointed to see that man again.
"To make a bad day worse, spend it wishing for the impossible." - Calvin of Calvin and Hobbes
It was evil
Isn't it some brand of evil to parade such eye candy in front of us for an hour with vague promises of making him Torchwood's new doc and then callously killing him off?
I was really looking forward to some new eye-candy, but than this is the same show that killed off a supposed main character in its very first episode.
Keeping Captain Jack in Context
I think sometimes folks forget the full trajectory and journey of the character Jack Harkness.
Much like "Buffy" and "Superman", Jack Harkness has an overall vision of the world that others don't (and not by his choice). He also used to be a time traveling grifter so his sense of "ethical" is inherently different.
But in terms of his "superhero" position, like the other, he has had to make these insane choices and decisions that no other human (or human like) character will ever have to make. He views the world similarly to The Doctor, from above and outside of with the past and future constantly comingling in his knowledge of life on Earth.
Clark Kent was an alien but he was raised on earth so emotionally, intellectually and spiritually he was human and that "humanity" made some of his choices much harder than they should have been.
Jack has all this knowledge about the past and future that guides his decisions and he couldn't always share them (even with Ianto).
Anyway, I just think giving that Jack has LITERALLY seen the beginning and ending of the Earth, he has a different grasp on morality and thats why he likes to have people like Gwen around because she is firmly routed (most of the time and sometimes to a fault) in being human.
Even Ianto (by virtue of his long history with Torchwood previous to coming to Cardiff) has a different perspective on morality, ethics and humanity than Gwen or Rhys would.
Having gone through the Captain Jack storyline of Doctor Who again recently, I realize how easy it is to forget who he "REALLY" is. He is not just a "man" who can't die, there is nothing "normal" about him and there is no way that folks could expect him to behave the way most "humans" would in a "save the world, life or death" kind of situations.
Human beings make "life or death" decisions all the time but rarely (if ever) has the entire world been at stake (which is ususally the case with Buffy, The Doctor, Jack Harness, etc)
People seemd to shocked but I just think when you've seen an entire Planet Earth destroyed, I'm sure 12 orphans seem like not a lot to lose in the grand scheme.
"That's our job today: to control the extent to which people can publicly manifest antigay sentiment." (Bayard Rustin) ** "Heterosexuality is not normal, it's just common" (Dorothy Parker)
The course of true love never did run smooth
The Janto relationship is a metaphor for the times. So much separates them, and yet they are together, for better or worse. I think young Ianto (talk about a May/December romance!) is just beginning to process some of the ramifications of his affaire de couer: he is finally coming clean to his family, but he still wants to believe this is a one-off entanglement (Jack may be the only man in his life, but when his sister asks Ianto what attracts him to Jack, he gushes something about Jack's being so "handsome"), and he is really bummed by the fact that he will grow old while Jack will always look the same. Of course, their relationship exists in the moment, but it is Jack's moment--for eternity--not Ianto's. By the time this five-episode arc concludes, I expect we'll see Ianto back in Jack's ever-lovin' arms, his doubts quashed, at least for the "moment." In the meantime, this is a fascinating series. When I was in London last week, I had occasion to watch an episode of the 1981 miniseries of "The Day of the Triffids," which was being shown in rerun on ITV. It originally unfolded over six episodes and was quite innovative in its use of "special" effects. All of John Wyndham's novels are variations on the Apocalypse theme, a thinly disguised metaphor for the Second World War. There's something about the prospect of the world's coming to an end that tends to bring humankind together. Add this to the idea of sacrifice in the form of 10% of our children, and you have the makings of an epic tragedy. Torchwood tends to overplay the end-of-the-world card a bit, but it still makes for compelling viewing.
"The mountain has wings."
PDA
Jack and Ianto do not need them, Ianto is repressed and a stuffed shirt so the PDA's do not come as second nature to him.
Plus he lost his girlfriend only a few years ago and is probably too self aware of getting hurt.
As for the old guy saying "queer" it was not offensive, If anything it was funny, He is still a little boy stuck in 1965 and he wasnt judging Ianto he was just saying what he smelt just like he did with gwen.
Sometimes people read too much into things.
Ianto
Lisa died in the 4th episode of the Season 1 which is almost two years ago by now within the context of Torchwood time.
Jack and Ianto have been sleeping together since the 8th episode of Season 1 which was December 2006 ( only only watch the original UK version so I don't know how this relates to BBC America).
My point is that Ianto and Jack have other things on their minds besides ex-lovers. They have been involved with each other for almost two years (off and on) and it's only know gotten to the point of being more "involved"
I agree that Ianto is repressed and not very demonstrative physically but I don't think his "issues" are about identity or Lisa.
Jack doesn't even identify as gay. He's had male and female lovers almost randomly.
I think Ianto is struggling with what it means to love Jack Harkness (specifically). It's something all Jack's ex-lovers have had to deal with: his secrecy, his immortality, the fact that he has traveled through time and across the universe, etc (even Jack's daugther has issues with it)
I don't think the "queer/gay" thing or Lisa is that important to Ianto right now.
"That's our job today: to control the extent to which people can publicly manifest antigay sentiment." (Bayard Rustin) ** "Heterosexuality is not normal, it's just common" (Dorothy Parker)
because Ianto missed seasons 1 and 2
Gradually, it is revealed that Ianto is conflicted with the realization that he will eventually die and since Jaci is immortal, he will be there to watch him go through it, and then carry on living.
Ianto already knew this. He's known since the end of season 1. This is all the Jack/Ianto in a relationship we were sold! A minute exposition for the benefit of new viewers? I thought their little conversation was meaningful and added absolutely nothing. It only got a small warmth and depth because of GDL's acting who's just too good.
I'm happy for those who are able to see anything akin a proper couple, a proper relationship there.
Enjoy it. I think it's time for me to read a book.
Contact Lenses
My first thought was that your partner could do some "self loving" while wearing the lenses and wherever you happend to be (as long as you had a laptop) you could see them and instruct or whatever...
So if Jack was in his office (wearing the lenses) and Ianto was working on one of the central computer terminals (you see where I'm going).
It sort of like silent video phone sex made naughtier by the ability to do it in "public" and much more flexible then both people having to have a video camera or a laptop.
I see definite real world applications.
Anyway, that's what occured to me. Someone else might have other ideas.
It's kind of like the stopwatch thing, the details are really left to each individual viewer's imagination...
"That's our job today: to control the extent to which people can publicly manifest antigay sentiment." (Bayard Rustin) ** "Heterosexuality is not normal, it's just common" (Dorothy Parker)
Contact lenses
My first thought was it was
My first thought was it was just like the stopwatch joke as well, it's left to the viewer's imaginations.
"In spite of language, in spite of intelligence and intuition andsympathy, one can never really communicate anything to anybody"-AldousHuxley
Day Four
YES!
So..
And
sorry
From the looks of it...
I was trying to avoid what was happening, but from what I read it's true.
Spoilers Suck
I hate that people tweet spoilers.
It sucks.
I'm not blaming anyone here.
But I just accidentally got spoiled because someone DID put "SPOILER" in their comment.
GUH!!!
Now I'm going to have to wait until after tomorrow to see how the story is resolved.
People couldn't just wait a freaking day to discuss it.
BAHHH!
"That's our job today: to control the extent to which people can publicly manifest antigay sentiment." (Bayard Rustin) ** "Heterosexuality is not normal, it's just common" (Dorothy Parker)
Spoilers are Great
Ianto's behavior
Well, for starters I will say that I've only seen some segments. The evil BBC bastards have been stalking YouTube to put a stop to full episode postings.
On the PDA front, I can kind of see where some might be upset, but I also see that they're playing up Ianto's uncertainty about his relationship with Jack. Most couples I know do not get very touchy-feely when they're having some kind of a row, and realistically speaking Jack and Ianto are having one.
There's no question that Ianto loves Jack. His behavior (and heroic rescue) make that very clear. But he's feeling very uncertain about loving an immortal man. It's the same issue that Jack's daughter (and her mother) has. Ianto did however try to initiate something, only to have it ruined by Rhys and beans (dammit!). It may be deliberate cock-blocking. Rhys probably isn't getting any at the moment so why should Jack and Ianto?
As for the old guy and the "queer" comment. It pays to keep in mind that he's way out of touch with modern culture. One thing Torchwood (and Doctor Who) does that I happen to think is praiseworthy is that they don't pretend that life was the same in all historical eras. The S1 episode Captain Jack Harkness for example illustrated the challenge of being gay in the 1940's. Likewise here, Clem has been out of sorts since a past era when "queers" could be and were reviled openly.
Interestingly, Ianto didn't dispute the "queer" comment, he merely proclaimed that it wasn't 1965 anymore. That was, in my opinion, really nice on two levels. One, Ianto isn't falling back on labels ("I'm not gay, I'm heteroflexible") nor was he in denial. Two, his defense was a more blanket one - calling people "queer" is no longer socially acceptable today. One need only consider the number of openly-gay men in Westminster wielding considerable influence to acknowledge that times have changed. Ianto is not defending nor apologizing, he's making it clear that the old guy is the one who's out of line.
Hopefully the full episode will be as entertaining as the snippets!
Still loving it
Admittedly, this episode was much slower paced than the previous two. But it was still fantastic. There was so much suspense, if only in waiting for the responses of the 456. There was also humour, and there was also some form of Janto.
It wasn't the fact that Jack and Ianto were sitting on opposite ends of the couch that bothered me the most. It was the fact that GWEN SAT IN BETWEEN THEM! And while I know that the Gwack storyline is dead and buried (thank God), I was still annoyed.
Damn beans!
PLEASE
Guys please don't discuss Day Four on the Day Three post, I'm not asking for my own benefit because I watched Day Four already but for goodness sake have the respect that is a frakkin' huge spoiler.
"To make a bad day worse, spend it wishing for the impossible." - Calvin of Calvin and Hobbes