Last week, to get you up to speed on the Torchwood series, we presented you with a Facebook recap of Seasons 1 and 2. We also had a new interview with Captain Jack himself, John Barrowman. Last night Torchwood: Children of Earth (Day One) premiered on BBC America and we're excited to launch the first of our five Facebook recaps for the five-part miniseries. Enjoy!
Note: Also after the break, selected screencaps from last night's episode! As always, please don't spoil the show for others by putting sensitive information in the subject lines of comments.
I haven't read any of the spoilers, so I'm just sooo excited to see the series return! For one, I thought it was a good episode. So much going on that I had no choice but to glue myself to the TV, just the way I like it! I haven't read any spoilers and I don't want to hear any, so from what I've seen (first ep ONLY) I like what I see. Ianto was sooooooo friggin' CUTE- I LOVE that he lost the car and just couldn't let it go. I don't know why Jack had that stick up his arse the whole episode, but he sure was M-O-O-D-Y!! I'm glad Gwen's preggers for obvious reasons, and I can't wait for tomorrow!!
Kitty
"Gay sex is so hot!"-Grace Adler from Will & Grace
Way back when I first learned this series of Torchwood would be just five episodes long, I had my doubts... after all, what could they do with just five episodes? Well, apparently plenty.
I've watched the entire series already but I promise I won't spoil a thing for those of you who haven't. Just know that it is indeed action packed, like Russell T. Davies promised... and also as promised, it takes a rather dark tone.
This first episode was great. It really carried itself well with the action, the humor, and the dynamic between the three remaining Torchwood members. It was fun to see Jack and Ianto especially, being all couple-y but doing their best to avoid the term couple. Those two have great chemistry and the fact that they get along so well off-camera really shows. If I had one tiny itsy bitsy complaint was that I just didn't see enough of them remembering their... (*Series 2 spoiler... look away if you haven't seen series 2*) fallen comrads, Tosh and Owen.
Last series, when Tosh and Owen died, the waterworks didn't stop for at least half an hour here... and it wasn't easy with my best friend yelling in the background, "Get over it! It's just a show!" I'm not saying they should have still been in mourning since obviously some time has passed but a little more of a connection to the past would have been nice to see and would have added more weight to what the Torchwoodies (yes, I call them that) find themselves in the midst of now.
Other than that, I enjoyed this episode thoroughly. It felt like Torchwood and that's one of the things I feared would be lost with this 5 episode format. Glad to be wrong.
Oh yes, agreed. How could I forget... thank you for speaking my language. Facebook is my go-to for everything these days. No, really. I rarely call my friends anymore and when they complain I just say, "What? I totally kept in touch with you through Facebook status messages!" Yeah... doesn't fly over very well.
I love the facebook recap! This episode was great. I'd seen it already on youtube (before it was taken down) and couldn't wait for the rest of the episodes. I loved the whole bit with Ianto and the car. It was a funny little part with everything else going on...plus it's kind of something that I would freak out about too.
Just one thing that I didn't like is why they were making this big deal out of Dr. Rupesh Patangali before the series started and then killed him in the frist episode. I was kind of excited to find out what would happen with him, but well...looks like we wont know.
comment that he isn't gay. That it's just Jack he's fallen for, not men in general. Does that bother you? Do you see it as progress in terms of how we see sexuality?
I've known one man in my life who became involved with a gay man and then went on to lead a straight life after they broke up. And, no, he wasn't a closet case. He just really cared about this one man.
...how it relates to gay politics--we hardly need more people carping about being gay as a choice--but in terms of these two characters it doesn't bother me much.
No, it's not "progress", any more than defining Capt. Jack as pansexual rather than gay is progress. It's a cop-out as much as anything, but in the service of getting audiences more comfortable with m2m romance onscreen, an area this show *has* pioneered to some extent.
i think that shows shouldn't do this all the time, and they haven't...
so far, all i've seen is hollyoaks (they did that twice actually) and torchwood do the whole "oh its just him" thing....now, i think they do this because they are trying to say "gay or not, thats not the point...love is"
but i dont want to see "oh its just him/its just her" over and over again. that wouldn't be progressive at all. spreading it out so to speak, is okay
It is worth noting that Western European and British people in general have an easier time coping intellectually with the Kinsey Scale than Americans do with our either/or attitude towards sexual orientation.
Bisexuality in America is generally translated as "promiscuity" (i.e. Jack's "omnisexuality", a word never actually used in Torchwood onscreen, only in press articles about Jack). The mindset is that people who feel any attraction to both genders are inherently flighty, prone to casual flings and get it on without regard to gender. Bisexuality in a relationship context is usually seen as a sign of emotional instability (e.g. Anne Heche, Lindsey Lohan).
But obviously we see a lot more bisexual activity plus serious and/or incidental romances on European TV (Alles Was Zaehlt, Clara Sheller, Verbotene Liebe, etc.). There certainly does seem to be more of a notion over there that an individual could potentially fall in love with someone of the same sex, even if their usually orientation is towards the opposite sex. Christian on Verbotene Liebe is such a character. He never demonstrated any confusion regarding his own sexuality until he met Olli. Being inclined to favor monogamy, he now self-identifies as "gay", even though it has never been stated that his past relationships with women, such as Coco, were ever sexually unfulfilling for him in any way. Audiences over there don't seem to have a problem buying into this.
Now as for Ianto, he's a tough nut to crack. Torchwood has not historically spent much time pondering questions of sexual orientation. Ianto himself is an incredibly uptight character who is usually very reserved about his feelings.
Could he simply be in love with Jack, as opposed to men in general? We seem to buy into this notion with Christian (although admittedly he doesn't say it out loud), so why not Ianto?
Now, I think that part of this is just the writers burnishing Jack's attractiveness credentials rather than making a political statement about sexuality. We're to take it that he's so extraordinary that even a "straight" man like Ianto could fall in love with his killer good looks and 51st Century pheromones.
Of course, Ianto is also a monogamist to the point of obsession, as was demonstrated with Lisa, to whom he remained absolutely faithful even after she was half converted into a cyberman. Based on what we've seen of Ianto over two series he probably doesn't spend a lot of time in self-examination of his relationship options. So it's doubtful he's given a lot of thought to dating men in general until his sister raised the question. But as Kinsey 2 or 3 he could easily be predominantly heterosexual and still have a specific attraction to Jack. Especially if Jack is as sexually-talented as the writers would have us believe he is.
So again, I think that this is all a statement about Jack's fabulousness rather than a statement about sexual politics.
And the same day that they caught their pet pterodactyl, when Ianto walked away crying, many interpreted that as he was so overwhelmed that he was finally going to be able to revive his girlfriend. Also, you might recall he BETRAYED Jack and the team to help his girlfriend, AT GUNPOINT no less, so HA!! "I'm smart, you're dumb; I'm big, you're little; I'm right, you're wrong, and there's nothing you can do about it!"-Matilda (I know that was random, but it seemed to fit the conversation)
Kitty
"Gay sex is so hot!"-Grace Adler from Will & Grace
"Bi today, Gay tomorrow." WTF!??!! Are you for real? PLEASE, enough already with these tiresome biphobic cliches (although I see you've also just written that you sometimes find us bis to be "tiresome").
These kinds of comments are about as welcome on a site for gay and bisexual men as someone writing that maybe Ianto just "Prayed the Gay Away".
I'm not sure it's a greater intellectual acceptance of the Kinsey
Scale in Western Europe and the UK, I think it's more a case of
fluidity in sexuality being culturally accepted. Apart from all the
sexually ambiguous monarchs and politicians who've littered
centuries-worth of history, it's been ingrained in literature and
entertainment since time immemorial.
There are references to it in Chaucer's Canturbury Tales
(the first ever 'English-language novel') and Shakespeare constantly
had his plucky masculine heroes falling for curiously alluring young
men who later turn out to be women (although they were played by
curiously alluring young men in Shakespeare's day).
If you shoot
forward to the 20th century you had all the First World War poets who
detailed the incredibly intense emotions generated among the soldiers,
which could turn sexual even if the men concerned weren't gay. Then
it's a hop, skip and a jump via the sexual tensions of Brideshead Revisited
into the Seventies when it virtually impossible to be a top British
singer without dabbling in sexual experimentation. And it was very
openly expressed back then.
One of my relatives by marriage
once stunned a family dinner by talking about the time she claimed she had slept
with Angie Bowie. Because there were children present, she quickly
explained that she wasn't lesbian, but it would have seemed impolite to
turn down the offer at the time. Her husband was at the same table and
he didn't bat an eye-lid.
There was a programme on TV back then called Top of the Pops.
In one episode, David Bowie was singing and he sidled up to his hunky
blond guitarist Mick Ronson and basically frotelysed him while fondling
his guitar. Instead of showing any distaste, Ronson played along with
it. There are still straight men around today (for example writer and
presenter Robert Elms) who saw it and will publically state that it was
one of the most erotically charged moments of their teen years. Not
homoerotic, just erotic.
Obviously, I could bore at length with examples of celebrated sexual ambiguity.
While
I agree with you that in this instance, the writers have been making a
point about Jack's irresistible fabulousness, it's not a particularly
new or revolutionary point. I think it only causes comment in the US
because of the hyper-masculine stereotype American men seem expected to
live up to.
Sexuality on it's own is complex, people try to lump it into specific categories because to most people it has to be straight gay or bi, there is no other option. But human feelings and emotions towards eachother are simply to complicated to lump into such categories. I think it's entirely possible that he fell in love with the PERSON rather than the sex of the person. Maybe Ianto is one of those people who can love anyone regardless of there sex. It's complicated but it's a good thing to show, it shows the broader spectrum of human emotions and feelings.
People fear what they don't understand.Thats why homophobes are so scared of gay people.
As we all know when a gay guy sleeps with a couple of girls or happens to fall in love with one (once in a VERY blue moon), they don't claim to be straight all of a sudden. I think that the more realistic approach is that you fall in love with whomever you fall in love with, especially if you're open to it (note I am VERY biased b/c I am bisexual, but still). You can't tell me that there aren't tons of straight guys whom have had a relationship with a man, then went back to dating just women. It would be crazy to think that it wouldn't happen.
Also, I like it b/c it shows that you can't put people into those little boxes of "straight", "gay", and "bisexual" since this is a sci fi show and all about testing standard human perceptions. It's just human nature and attraction, and all you can do is ride the current to wherever it might take you.
Now, if Ianto comes out and says later he is gay or bi, then I wouldn't be upset about him not coming out sooner either. Who really knows what Ianto wants in the long run but Ianto?
Kitty
"Gay sex is so hot!"-Grace Adler from Will & Grace
It annoys me that the "He's gay!" "He's gay!" is what we got instead of
what we were promised: a proper development of the relationship between
Jack and Ianto. That's not developing anything, that's cheating. I also liked that in the old Torchwood no one really made an issue about sexuality, they just were people who got together (or not). RTD went on so much about it! RTD took all the retcon Torchwood Cardiff had left.
Apart from that, I rarely pay too much attention to JB about
Torchwood, because he's always saying how he just doesn't think too much about the scenes and just plays them as they come, and because he's always seemed to be in the
Gwack camp, BUT something he said about Ianto in the Gay Times interview
makes sense to me:
"Ianto is not confused, but he's fallen in love with a man," Barrowman explains.
"He never saw himself as being gay, but for the first time he's fallen in love
with a man. It's something new that's happened to him.
I don't know what to think about the politics of it all. RTD seems convinced is a modern and more natural attitude. I'm just a bit clueless, I'm afraid.
Doesn't bother me I don't know why people would be bothered by this. It looks like progress as people don't just fall into straight, gay, bisexual. Looks like progress to me.
think it is what it is. Who's to say where your heart is going to lead you. I believe you really don't have much control over whom you fall in love with, When there's a connection and both people feel it, it doesn't matter. Lisa and Jack...two completely different beings and yet each of them had something that caused Ianto to be willing to fight for them.
"Love isn't a decision, its a feeling. If we could decide who we loved, it would be much simpler, but much less magical." (Parker and Stone)
Alright, not bad
I haven't read any of the spoilers, so I'm just sooo excited to see the series return! For one, I thought it was a good episode. So much going on that I had no choice but to glue myself to the TV, just the way I like it! I haven't read any spoilers and I don't want to hear any, so from what I've seen (first ep ONLY) I like what I see. Ianto was sooooooo friggin' CUTE- I LOVE that he lost the car and just couldn't let it go. I don't know why Jack had that stick up his arse the whole episode, but he sure was M-O-O-D-Y!! I'm glad Gwen's preggers for obvious reasons, and I can't wait for tomorrow!!
Kitty
"Gay sex is so hot!"-Grace Adler from Will & Grace
Not going to spoil... I promise!
Way back when I first learned this series of Torchwood would be just five episodes long, I had my doubts... after all, what could they do with just five episodes? Well, apparently plenty.
I've watched the entire series already but I promise I won't spoil a thing for those of you who haven't. Just know that it is indeed action packed, like Russell T. Davies promised... and also as promised, it takes a rather dark tone.
This first episode was great. It really carried itself well with the action, the humor, and the dynamic between the three remaining Torchwood members. It was fun to see Jack and Ianto especially, being all couple-y but doing their best to avoid the term couple. Those two have great chemistry and the fact that they get along so well off-camera really shows. If I had one tiny itsy bitsy complaint was that I just didn't see enough of them remembering their... (*Series 2 spoiler... look away if you haven't seen series 2*) fallen comrads, Tosh and Owen.
Last series, when Tosh and Owen died, the waterworks didn't stop for at least half an hour here... and it wasn't easy with my best friend yelling in the background, "Get over it! It's just a show!" I'm not saying they should have still been in mourning since obviously some time has passed but a little more of a connection to the past would have been nice to see and would have added more weight to what the Torchwoodies (yes, I call them that) find themselves in the midst of now.
Other than that, I enjoyed this episode thoroughly. It felt like Torchwood and that's one of the things I feared would be lost with this 5 episode format. Glad to be wrong.
That'll Flat Git It, StuntDouble!!!
. . .and 10 Kudos to yuz for the Facebook style of presentation.
Oh yes, agreed. How could I
That really is brilliant
I'm slightly stunned by how accurate, comprehensive, funny and wildly creative this recap is. It's a triumph at every level.
Can't wait to see how it progresses over the week.
Fabulous Day 1 Facebook Recap
I'm going into maximum overload on all the Torchwood discussions on forums, livejournals, blogs, etc. and I'm loving it.
StuntDouble - I'm enjoying all your Facebook pages for Torchwood.
Love me less, but love me a long time - Les Chansons D'Amour
very funny
this is some very funny stuff. :-)
So great!
I love the facebook recap! This episode was great. I'd seen it already on youtube (before it was taken down) and couldn't wait for the rest of the episodes. I loved the whole bit with Ianto and the car. It was a funny little part with everything else going on...plus it's kind of something that I would freak out about too.
Just one thing that I didn't like is why they were making this big deal out of Dr. Rupesh Patangali before the series started and then killed him in the frist episode. I was kind of excited to find out what would happen with him, but well...looks like we wont know.
I want to know what everyone thinks about Ianto's
comment that he isn't gay. That it's just Jack he's fallen for, not men in general. Does that bother you? Do you see it as progress in terms of how we see sexuality?
I've known one man in my life who became involved with a gay man and then went on to lead a straight life after they broke up. And, no, he wasn't a closet case. He just really cared about this one man.
I don't like it much in terms of...
...how it relates to gay politics--we hardly need more people carping about being gay as a choice--but in terms of these two characters it doesn't bother me much.
No, it's not "progress", any more than defining Capt. Jack as pansexual rather than gay is progress. It's a cop-out as much as anything, but in the service of getting audiences more comfortable with m2m romance onscreen, an area this show *has* pioneered to some extent.
i think that...
i think that shows shouldn't do this all the time, and they haven't...
so far, all i've seen is hollyoaks (they did that twice actually) and torchwood do the whole "oh its just him" thing....now, i think they do this because they are trying to say "gay or not, thats not the point...love is"
but i dont want to see "oh its just him/its just her" over and over again. that wouldn't be progressive at all. spreading it out so to speak, is okay
Ianto's sexuality
It is worth noting that Western European and British people in general have an easier time coping intellectually with the Kinsey Scale than Americans do with our either/or attitude towards sexual orientation.
Bisexuality in America is generally translated as "promiscuity" (i.e. Jack's "omnisexuality", a word never actually used in Torchwood onscreen, only in press articles about Jack). The mindset is that people who feel any attraction to both genders are inherently flighty, prone to casual flings and get it on without regard to gender. Bisexuality in a relationship context is usually seen as a sign of emotional instability (e.g. Anne Heche, Lindsey Lohan).
But obviously we see a lot more bisexual activity plus serious and/or incidental romances on European TV (Alles Was Zaehlt, Clara Sheller, Verbotene Liebe, etc.). There certainly does seem to be more of a notion over there that an individual could potentially fall in love with someone of the same sex, even if their usually orientation is towards the opposite sex. Christian on Verbotene Liebe is such a character. He never demonstrated any confusion regarding his own sexuality until he met Olli. Being inclined to favor monogamy, he now self-identifies as "gay", even though it has never been stated that his past relationships with women, such as Coco, were ever sexually unfulfilling for him in any way. Audiences over there don't seem to have a problem buying into this.
Now as for Ianto, he's a tough nut to crack. Torchwood has not historically spent much time pondering questions of sexual orientation. Ianto himself is an incredibly uptight character who is usually very reserved about his feelings.
Could he simply be in love with Jack, as opposed to men in general? We seem to buy into this notion with Christian (although admittedly he doesn't say it out loud), so why not Ianto?
Now, I think that part of this is just the writers burnishing Jack's attractiveness credentials rather than making a political statement about sexuality. We're to take it that he's so extraordinary that even a "straight" man like Ianto could fall in love with his killer good looks and 51st Century pheromones.
Of course, Ianto is also a monogamist to the point of obsession, as was demonstrated with Lisa, to whom he remained absolutely faithful even after she was half converted into a cyberman. Based on what we've seen of Ianto over two series he probably doesn't spend a lot of time in self-examination of his relationship options. So it's doubtful he's given a lot of thought to dating men in general until his sister raised the question. But as Kinsey 2 or 3 he could easily be predominantly heterosexual and still have a specific attraction to Jack. Especially if Jack is as sexually-talented as the writers would have us believe he is.
So again, I think that this is all a statement about Jack's fabulousness rather than a statement about sexual politics.
Post deleted for inappropriate comment.
You're wrong in that sense
If you recall, the reasoning behind that was because Ianto needed a way to bring his girlfriend back to life, so he needed Torchwood, not Jack.
Kitty
"Gay sex is so hot!"-Grace Adler from Will & Grace
Oh really?
So no straight man would EVER compliment another guy on a coat?
Really?
And the same day that they caught their pet pterodactyl, when Ianto walked away crying, many interpreted that as he was so overwhelmed that he was finally going to be able to revive his girlfriend. Also, you might recall he BETRAYED Jack and the team to help his girlfriend, AT GUNPOINT no less, so HA!! "I'm smart, you're dumb; I'm big, you're little; I'm right, you're wrong, and there's nothing you can do about it!"-Matilda (I know that was random, but it seemed to fit the conversation)
Kitty
"Gay sex is so hot!"-Grace Adler from Will & Grace
You've GOT to be kidding, David!
"Bi today, Gay tomorrow." WTF!??!! Are you for real? PLEASE, enough already with these tiresome biphobic cliches (although I see you've also just written that you sometimes find us bis to be "tiresome").
These kinds of comments are about as welcome on a site for gay and bisexual men as someone writing that maybe Ianto just "Prayed the Gay Away".
We don't tolerate denigrating comments toward anyone's sexuality
Kinsey Kulture
I'm not sure it's a greater intellectual acceptance of the Kinsey Scale in Western Europe and the UK, I think it's more a case of fluidity in sexuality being culturally accepted. Apart from all the sexually ambiguous monarchs and politicians who've littered centuries-worth of history, it's been ingrained in literature and entertainment since time immemorial.
There are references to it in Chaucer's Canturbury Tales (the first ever 'English-language novel') and Shakespeare constantly had his plucky masculine heroes falling for curiously alluring young men who later turn out to be women (although they were played by curiously alluring young men in Shakespeare's day).
If you shoot forward to the 20th century you had all the First World War poets who detailed the incredibly intense emotions generated among the soldiers, which could turn sexual even if the men concerned weren't gay. Then it's a hop, skip and a jump via the sexual tensions of Brideshead Revisited into the Seventies when it virtually impossible to be a top British singer without dabbling in sexual experimentation. And it was very openly expressed back then.
One of my relatives by marriage once stunned a family dinner by talking about the time she claimed she had slept with Angie Bowie. Because there were children present, she quickly explained that she wasn't lesbian, but it would have seemed impolite to turn down the offer at the time. Her husband was at the same table and he didn't bat an eye-lid.
There was a programme on TV back then called Top of the Pops. In one episode, David Bowie was singing and he sidled up to his hunky blond guitarist Mick Ronson and basically frotelysed him while fondling his guitar. Instead of showing any distaste, Ronson played along with it. There are still straight men around today (for example writer and presenter Robert Elms) who saw it and will publically state that it was one of the most erotically charged moments of their teen years. Not homoerotic, just erotic.
Obviously, I could bore at length with examples of celebrated sexual ambiguity.
While I agree with you that in this instance, the writers have been making a point about Jack's irresistible fabulousness, it's not a particularly new or revolutionary point. I think it only causes comment in the US because of the hyper-masculine stereotype American men seem expected to live up to.
I dont mind it
Sexuality on it's own is complex, people try to lump it into specific categories because to most people it has to be straight gay or bi, there is no other option. But human feelings and emotions towards eachother are simply to complicated to lump into such categories. I think it's entirely possible that he fell in love with the PERSON rather than the sex of the person. Maybe Ianto is one of those people who can love anyone regardless of there sex. It's complicated but it's a good thing to show, it shows the broader spectrum of human emotions and feelings.
People fear what they don't understand.Thats why homophobes are so scared of gay people.
Personally Michael, I think it makes the character more real
As we all know when a gay guy sleeps with a couple of girls or happens to fall in love with one (once in a VERY blue moon), they don't claim to be straight all of a sudden. I think that the more realistic approach is that you fall in love with whomever you fall in love with, especially if you're open to it (note I am VERY biased b/c I am bisexual, but still). You can't tell me that there aren't tons of straight guys whom have had a relationship with a man, then went back to dating just women. It would be crazy to think that it wouldn't happen.
Also, I like it b/c it shows that you can't put people into those little boxes of "straight", "gay", and "bisexual" since this is a sci fi show and all about testing standard human perceptions. It's just human nature and attraction, and all you can do is ride the current to wherever it might take you.
Now, if Ianto comes out and says later he is gay or bi, then I wouldn't be upset about him not coming out sooner either. Who really knows what Ianto wants in the long run but Ianto?
Kitty
"Gay sex is so hot!"-Grace Adler from Will & Grace
is he?
It annoys me that the "He's gay!" "He's gay!" is what we got instead of what we were promised: a proper development of the relationship between Jack and Ianto. That's not developing anything, that's cheating. I also liked that in the old Torchwood no one really made an issue about sexuality, they just were people who got together (or not). RTD went on so much about it! RTD took all the retcon Torchwood Cardiff had left.
Apart from that, I rarely pay too much attention to JB about Torchwood, because he's always saying how he just doesn't think too much about the scenes and just plays them as they come, and because he's always seemed to be in the Gwack camp, BUT something he said about Ianto in the Gay Times interview makes sense to me:
"Ianto is not confused, but he's fallen in love with a man," Barrowman explains. "He never saw himself as being gay, but for the first time he's fallen in love with a man. It's something new that's happened to him.
I don't know what to think about the politics of it all. RTD seems convinced is a modern and more natural attitude. I'm just a bit clueless, I'm afraid.
Doesn't bother me I don't
Doesn't bother me I don't know why people would be bothered by this. It looks like progress as people don't just fall into straight, gay, bisexual. Looks like progress to me.
I, for one,
think it is what it is. Who's to say where your heart is going to lead you. I believe you really don't have much control over whom you fall in love with, When there's a connection and both people feel it, it doesn't matter. Lisa and Jack...two completely different beings and yet each of them had something that caused Ianto to be willing to fight for them.
"Love isn't a decision, its a feeling. If we could decide who we loved, it would be much simpler, but much less magical." (Parker and Stone)