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L.A. Times Article Discusses the ATWT Kissing IssueSoap fans claim bias against gay characters
'As the World Turns' couple is relegated to hugs and off-screen affection when hetero pairs smooch away, viewers complain.
It all started last Christmas, when Luke and Noah, the young gay couple
on "As The World Turns," were about to kiss. Though fans had seen them
kiss before, this time the camera panned up to the mistletoe. Over the next few months, while heterosexual couples were kissing, Nuke (as fans call the couple) was restricted to holding hands, playing with one another's neck scarves and sharing meaningful looks. Ensuing complaints of discrimination to CBS and the show's producer and sponsor, Procter & Gamble, had no effect. And the last straw apparently arrived on Valentine's Day, when every other couple but Nuke shared a kiss. They hugged instead. Read the rest here. Submitted by Anthony D. Langford (4228 points) (830 posts) on Thu, 2008-02-21 18:45. |
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Possible NY Daily News Nuke article tomorrow
There is word that we may see something on the topic from the New York Daily News tomorrow. This is a direct result of the Support Luke and Noah media blitz that is going on. It's nice to see that the mainstream press is responding. This shows that it is possible to get some attention focussed on this issue.
What impresses me about this article...
...is that we're clearly seeing that it is P&G who are censoring Nuke's intimacy and not CBS--in fact, CBS recognizes that Nuke is a primary reason that the show's ratings have improved.
And I love the hypocrisy in the P&G statement that they're "trying to be sensitive to all the different audiences" of the show--so, Emily can be a prostitute, Alison can be a meth-snorting porn star, and Craig can attempt to murder Paul, but two young men in love kissing--not an option. Argggh.
You know the rule
It's okay for a man to kill a man, but God forbid that he should love one.
American TV is very weird this way. We're fine with violence and always have been. Some uppity groups claim that violent TV is a recent innovation but even as far back as the 1950's kids were watching cowboy shows that were filled with fist fights and gun fights alike (although you couldn't show blood).
Likewise, some morons argue that same-sex smooching on daytime TV would be detrimental to kids that might be at home with Mom watching it. That heterosexual adultery, fornication and prostitution go side-by-side with murder plots and other criminal activities on these shows without the presence of gays is apparently not a problem. Hotprechaun, shirt-off, making out with an ex-whore who is not his wife is not dangerous to children. A couple of gay guys doing the exact same thing? Why, it could warp their fragile little minds!
It really all boils down to two key points:
1) Homophobic people who can't stand the sight of gay people actually doing "gay" things, such as kissing. Physical intimacy is after all meant only for heterosexuals according to God.
2) Children who see Nuke kissing might decide that homosexuality isn't as revolting as their parents may think it is and thus grow up into tolerant adults. Tolerance is the Devil's Tool you know.
I LOVE this one though: "She said the sponsors are very committed to continuing the story of the pair, who are coming of age in a small Midwestern town. "It's a very authentic kind of story."
Because I know so many teenagers that are saving their kisses for marriage! And what's with the "small Midwestern town" schtick. Oakdale appears to have hi-rise buildings, a sizeable university, large businesses and other accoutrements of a small city. This is not Mayberry!
Just an aside...
And what's with the "small Midwestern town" schtick. Oakdale appears to have hi-rise buildings, a sizeable university, large businesses and other accoutrements of a small city. This is not Mayberry!
I always find it hilarious when characters refer to Oakdale as a "small town," yet when Paul lived at the penthouse at The Lakeview, outside the window were these skyscrapers to rival Chicago!
Heard about the rule years ago
Psionycx wrote :
It's okay for a man to kill a man, but God forbid that he should love one.
American TV is very weird this way. We're fine with violence and always have been. Some uppity groups claim that violent TV is a recent innovation but even as far back as the 1950's kids were watching cowboy shows that were filled with fist fights and gun fights alike (although you couldn't show blood).
Campion :
Your comment about the rule about how a guy can kill another guy but can't be seen loving another guy is reminded me of something that was said in an old episode of the sitcom Murphy Brown that has stuck with me for years.
The gay character for the episode remarks something along the lines that the same people who go nuts over two guys having a conversation are the same people who would watch two guys try to kill each other with machine guns and would watch that with their children.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYBdO7I5fXk
Had meant to post about this in Brent and Michael's two gay guy vlog. Thanks for the reminder.
American Manhood
Remember though, the guys shooting off machine guns are asserting their masculinity through their acts of violence. That is to be idealized to kids, especially boys, because it shows them that real men are brave and strong and willing to shoot at each other. This is especially true if there is a female character to be impressed by all this masculine behavior.
Loving another man emasculates a man however, because it makes him subject to softer emotions, worst of all directed at another man. It also leads to sexual perversion where the man will of course surrender his male privilege and allow his body to be defiled by another man's penis as if he were, well, a woman!
God, who established the male/female duality with males as superior to the females that were created from a man's body, naturally condemns this. It says so right there in the Bible.
Actually, the Bible goes on a lot more extensively about the evils of adultery, but those are forgivable of course, so long as a man commits adultery with a woman of course. Likewise, murder is also technically forbidden, but exceptions may be allowed if, for example, you murder someone who isn't of your faith or nation or if they simply stood between you and something you wanted (very common, especially in the Old Testament).
Killing is often brave and honorable. Likewise, men having sex with women outside of marriage is a sin, but a forgivable one. After all, in these cases proper gender roles are at least being obeyed. But a couple of queers? Well that's just immoral!
These People are F**king Looney Tunes
We all understand that these people are against any representation of homosexulaity that is three-demensional and uncritical of the "gay lifestyle, right?" Because then gays, especially gay kids, would look at these representations and see that there's nothing wrong with being gay and not end up crippled by self-loathing. They want gays to hate themselves and "repent."
These morons also believe that seeing gay people can make you gay, so what the fuck ever.
The kisses have stopped
Americanus Horribilous
Well, I was right. Who has the most clout in this land, why "the disgusting American Family Assoc." They have a dedicated and focused base that can be coordinated in an instant to object to anything they find offensive! What do they find "offensive?" Well, you all already know. You've all said it in so many ways...they love men killing men to impress women! And what do they hate more than murder, adultery, psychopaths? Of course, two men loving each other.
They have the power; we do not. Luke & Noah is over. I only follow on AfterElton and gave up really after the Christmas/New Years fiasco!
Love you all!
Amadeus
Like pilgrims they are!
I am of the opinion that the producers are just afraid of losing the core audience they had before the Luke and Noah storyline first began. I guess they figured “Let’s have the guys kiss like once or twice in order to create some buzz. At the same time get the gay guys and teen girls hooked on the show. Then so as to not to completely freak out all the housewives of America, we’ll relegate the boys to hand holding and some light petting until we feel it‘s safe to progress to the next level of face touching. We’ll desensitize these folks to the boys queer ways before we can have them mackin’ on each other on a regular basis.” That’s just my far-fetched hypothesis. However if that is the case, they are sure taking their sweet ass time. My question is this though: If they’re trying to be so sensitive towards the homophobes who watch the show, why can’t they be sensitive towards my intolerance of monotonous storylines and dense characters? Hm? Riddle me that!
CBS spokesmen said the
CBS spokesmen said the show's ratings have increased since the pair were introduced last year. "CBS supports the producers' vision for the Luke and Noah storyline," according to a statement. "We have not censored it or asked them to hold back in any way."
So, the ratings went up with the introduction of Nuke! CBS has now put it on record?! My question to CBS then would be what happens when all those new viewers leave? What happens when these new viewers get tired of the absolutely terrible writing that's been taking place for the last 2 months at least?
It makes me crazy how lame the writing for ATWT has been since December! And the way they have been killing off characters because they either released them or the actors quit. Why is it that TPTB are so damn stupid? You can't keep viewers or gain new ones if your writing is crap! It's like they live in a fantasy bubble world where they assume the viewers are lameO idiots who can't find anything else to do when they've had enough of this junk! I think this is what makes me so mad. I am not sitting here watching drek. I can do all sorts of other things! Network television is losing viewers by the droves more and more each year, Not because there are other things to do and other ways of watching, but because Network television is just crap! And they just won't get it!
"You bit the hand, Marty, You bit the hand!"
American Family
Sometimes I wish they'd
Sometimes I wish they'd never given Luke a boyfriend. At least then he had a reason not to be kissing anyone. But now he's got this hot, ready, and more-than-willing young man in his life, and he still can't kiss anyone. I think it sends more of a negative message to give him a boyfriend he can never kiss than it was to not give him one at all. Every time Luke and Noah are interupted or pushed aside for a clump of mistletoe's acting debut, it says that the guys' affection is too taboo to show. "We'll show you hookers and drugs and adultery, but two guys kissing is too much!"
But then I read this article, and realize that P&G's blatant double standard is generating a lot of good dialogue out there. I know too many people who think that bigotry and double standards are a thing of the past. Hopefully this will wake some of them up and get them out of their complacency.
I have to agree about Nuke
Especially because of how this has been handled.
Noah was introduced as a new character and within no time flat he was dating Maddie. Their relationship was very physical, with lots of making out and sex on at least one occasion.
But then they put him in a relationship with Luke and suddenly physical affection was off-limits. I'm left wondering if they would even allow them to hug if it weren't for all the heavy winter clothes.
That really does convey a subtle, but distinct message. Noah hooking up with Maddie and having pre-marital sex after dating for a short time was perfectly fine. But even so much as kissing Luke is too shocking to be shown.
That really sends a pretty ugly message.
You know, I've just realized
It does send an ugly message. I hope the attention from the media and viewers continues to shine a bit of light on it.